4:19 Jump the Shark
Did Supernatural jump the shark in Season 4, Episode 19? Find out that and all about Ghouls, Ghouls, Ghouls on this week's episode.
Research Links
- 4.19 Jump the Shark - Super-wiki
- Cultural Analysis, Volume 8, 2009: The Mythical Ghoul in Arabic Culture / Ahmed Al-Rawi
- ghoul | Definition, Mythology, & Meaning | Britannica
- Al-Rawi, Ahmed K. “The Arabic Ghoul and Its Western Transformation.” Folklore, vol. 120, no. 3, 2009, pp. 291–306. JSTOR, http://www.jstor.org/stable/40646532. Accessed 21 Jun. 2022.
- Ghoul - Description, History, Myths and Interpretations | Mythology.net
Transcript
On this week's episode of Devil's Trap podcast, you'll hear about Sam Winchester's shooting school, where you can just be okay and safety is second.
Speaker B:And also, ghouls, ghouls, ghouls.
Speaker B:All right, let's do this.
Speaker A:Welcome to this week's episode of Devil's Trap podcast.
Speaker A:I'm Diana.
Speaker B:I'm Liz.
Speaker A:And we're going to Talk Season 4, Episode 19, Jump a Shark.
Speaker B:Yeah, I'm sorry if I just burped in the microphone again, which just seems to always happen, like, I'll be fine.
Speaker B:And then as soon as, like, we start recording, I'm like, like, I, I.
Speaker B:What is that trigger?
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:Jump in the shark.
Speaker B:Jump in the shark.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:So before we get to that, how are you?
Speaker A:How's your weekend?
Speaker A:What's going on in your world?
Speaker B:Like, what did I do this weekend?
Speaker A:You got a badass new hairdo.
Speaker B:Oh, that's right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:No, I went.
Speaker B:Saturday was hair day and I dyed and shaved and, you know, did all sorts of new fun things.
Speaker B:So if you're, if you see our intro, you can, you can see, you can see our video.
Speaker B:Thanks.
Speaker B:So I did that and then, then I bruised myself back on a hoop on Sunday.
Speaker B:So back off of the stupid trapeze, never getting on that fucking thing again.
Speaker B:And back on the more torturous metal.
Speaker A:Hoop, you know, like you do Lehigh.
Speaker A:I had a quite active weekend.
Speaker A:I felt real young and real old all at once.
Speaker A:So Friday night I had a night out with my sister.
Speaker A:My brother in law, Babe, obviously was there, and my brother was in town visiting, so we did a nice dinner with everybody.
Speaker A:And then we went to Deep Ellum because our friend's punk rock band was playing, which was fun to see.
Speaker A:Our friend mob84, they were really good.
Speaker A:And then of course we got to see part of Dog Company, which is always fun, but we were actually down there because GZA from Wu Tang Clan was at Trees doing Liquid Swords, which is one of the greatest hip hop albums of all time by most accounts, by the way, not just my opinion.
Speaker A:Uh, so anyways, we got to go to that.
Speaker A:Really cool.
Speaker A:My, my caveats are this, sometimes an.
Speaker A:An artist, no matter how amazing of a lyricist they are, are better with their group as far as their performance quality fair.
Speaker A:And it's really hard for an artist that uses so many guests on all of their songs to do a solo show, so.
Speaker A:And of course also, and this is a trend in some music, not all venues, but some music, and especially in Hip hop is going on fucking late.
Speaker A:It's a thing in the hip hop.
Speaker B:Nope.
Speaker A:And I'm just saying the show is old.
Speaker A:We old.
Speaker B:We old.
Speaker A:We thought the show was going to start at 9, then it was 9:45.
Speaker A:All right, fine, fine.
Speaker A: Then we hear: Speaker A:We're like, what?
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A: He went on stage at: Speaker B:What the fuck were you doing with those four hours?
Speaker A:Well, that's why we went to and watched our friends bands at Three Links across the street.
Speaker A:So I got to go to two clubs across the street from the other.
Speaker A:So that was cool.
Speaker B:No, no, no, not you.
Speaker B:I mean, just artists in general.
Speaker A:He was I think smoking large amounts of weed, eating some amazing vegan food cooked by a chef friend of ours and playing chess with people that wanted to.
Speaker A:That paid for a VIP program to play chess against him.
Speaker A:Which is kind of cool.
Speaker A:But at the same time, come on.
Speaker B:Also time your shit.
Speaker B:Time your shit.
Speaker B:Other people have shit to do.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So I was tired.
Speaker A:And then on Saturday night, my, there's a really cool show.
Speaker A:Americana artists.
Speaker A:I did punk rock and hip hop Friday, country on Saturday.
Speaker A:So Americana sounds like you.
Speaker A:Yeah, I was like, this is.
Speaker A:Yeah, I was like, it makes sense.
Speaker A:So we went and saw Sarah Shook and the Disarmers with my friend Joshua Ray Walker doing a co headline show at the Kessler Theater in Oak Cliff.
Speaker A:And it was super fun.
Speaker A:The opener was great too.
Speaker A:Aaron Vance.
Speaker A:But we, it was a really good time.
Speaker A:It was a lot of people, a lot of friends.
Speaker A:So like Friday was punk rock and hip hop with family.
Speaker A:Saturday was country with friends.
Speaker A:It was kind of that.
Speaker A:So it was a good time.
Speaker A:And I even, I even went to the after party at another bar and I stayed out till two in the morning.
Speaker A:I felt real sleepy after that.
Speaker A:I got home real late.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Liz is making a face at me.
Speaker A:She doesn't know who I am.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I think I may be freezing again.
Speaker B:But if my face freezes like that, that is fine.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:But yeah, we, it was a good weekend.
Speaker A:It was very, very, very activity filled.
Speaker A:But it was really cool to see my brother.
Speaker A:He was visiting for the weekend and now I'm sleepy and counting down to this weekend because this weekend Babe and I are going to visit Liz.
Speaker B:Yay.
Speaker B:And you're coming to pick up rum and then visit me in the process.
Speaker A:Yeah, you're kind of the priority.
Speaker A:Rum's just like a good timing piece of it.
Speaker A:It's like, oh, it's time to pick up Rum that makes a convenient time to go visit Liz.
Speaker A:All right, so let's talk about Jump the Shark.
Speaker B:So you know where that title comes from, right?
Speaker A:Well, it's from Happy Days when they jumped a shark.
Speaker A:It was ridiculous.
Speaker A:It was.
Speaker A:And it's now become like the terminology for when something is completely ridiculous.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Or basically when a TV show is doing something to order to try and boost its ratings.
Speaker B:Like, you know, the.
Speaker B:The biggest example which will come.
Speaker B:Comes out.
Speaker B:Is nodded to in this episode is when the Brady Bunch added cousin Oliver because they needed, like, a younger face because the Brady's got kids got too old or whatever.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker B:Yeah, so.
Speaker B:And that is very obvious why that was, what was.
Speaker B:And when this episode was actually coming out, there was, you know, people, they kind of.
Speaker B:They were alluding to this third Winchester brother coming in the promos and stuff.
Speaker B:And some people really were like.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And freaked out in general.
Speaker A:Yeah, I could see that.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:And so this was season four, episode 19.
Speaker B:We're almost the end of the season.
Speaker B: ,: Speaker B:It was directed by our favorite suit wearing Phil Scritchia and written by Andrew Dabb in Daniel Laughlin.
Speaker B:And we last saw this pair with the unfortunately named Yellow Fever episode.
Speaker B:Just some news on Andrew.
Speaker B:He is the showrunner on a new Netflix series, Grendel, which is based on Dark Horse comics about an assassin.
Speaker B:Assassin who ascends to the top of the New York criminal underworld.
Speaker B:And that's in post production, so that should probably be coming out pretty soon.
Speaker B:But the casting looks interesting.
Speaker B:It's just.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:It could be nice.
Speaker B:I mean, I like another comic book adaptation, but.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So we'll save our feelings about this show for.
Speaker A:But I think they'll come through.
Speaker A:As we're talking about.
Speaker B:I think they will probably come out.
Speaker B:So we're gonna start off with an interior house shot.
Speaker A:Yeah, It's a dark hallway and a woman running through the hall and slams the door and close herself into a room.
Speaker A:And she's wearing nurse scrubs and moves the arm and something's beating on the door, like, chasing her.
Speaker A:And she moves the armoire to block the door.
Speaker A:She sits down on the bed.
Speaker A:And then they did a really like.
Speaker A:It was well shot.
Speaker A:They do like.
Speaker A:It's creepy as fuck.
Speaker A:There's multiple reasons to dislike this episode.
Speaker A:I'm just gonna say it was creepy as fuck.
Speaker A:And they do a shot from under the bed of her feet.
Speaker A:And it keeps going back to that slowly.
Speaker A:And then something grabs her Fucking feet.
Speaker A:And drags her under the bed.
Speaker A:And then a photo falls off the bedside table.
Speaker A:Who is that man in the photo?
Speaker B:It's John Winchester.
Speaker B:What the fuck?
Speaker A:Who is this woman?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And also, how dare you have something come out from underneath the bed.
Speaker A:Oh, so wrong.
Speaker A:So wrong.
Speaker A:Keep getting grabbed from underneath the bed.
Speaker A:He be fucking GB's big time.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:At least I have the comfort of knowing that the space underneath my bed is so small that I could not be dragged underneath it.
Speaker A:I think I have too much crap stored in her mind.
Speaker A:So, I mean.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's just gonna have to, like, maneuver.
Speaker B:Like, you will hear stuff getting moved around.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So that's how this episode starts.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So, yeah, we cut to our.
Speaker A:Our brothers.
Speaker A:We're, like, standing.
Speaker A:I guess they couldn't get a motel that night.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:They're by a water.
Speaker B:It's a lovely lake.
Speaker B:I mean, I guess if you're gonna sleep in a car.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And Sam is standing outside brushing his teeth as Dean wakes up looking a little rough.
Speaker A:And he's hungry, but there's far from food.
Speaker A:So Sam suggests the sandwich in the back seat.
Speaker A:And I'm appalled.
Speaker A:Appalled at this because Dan looks in the bag and sniffs it and makes a gag face because it's a fucking tuna sandwich.
Speaker A:Who brings tuna on a road trip?
Speaker A:You are a monster.
Speaker B:Gross.
Speaker B:Gross people.
Speaker B:Gross people.
Speaker A:Tuna.
Speaker A:I like, like.
Speaker A:I like a tuna sandwich.
Speaker A:I like a tuna melt.
Speaker A:Whatever.
Speaker A:Not upset by it.
Speaker A:But you don't eat that in the.
Speaker A:On a road trip.
Speaker A:That's just rude.
Speaker B:Well, I mean, one, the car is gonna smell like fish.
Speaker B:Two, like, you just left it.
Speaker B:Yeah, we're gonna move on because I gotta vomit.
Speaker B:All right, so the phone.
Speaker B:A phone starts ringing and it's gonna.
Speaker B:And we play the Whose Phone is this game?
Speaker A:It's John's phone in the glove box.
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:Who's calling?
Speaker A:John.
Speaker A:So Dean answers it and they ask for John.
Speaker A:He's like, oh, he can't come to the phone.
Speaker A:And they're like, oh, this is Adam Milligan.
Speaker A:He knows me.
Speaker A:And Dean's like, yeah, he been dead for two years.
Speaker B:He did.
Speaker B:He reeled it.
Speaker B:He's so dead we burned him.
Speaker A:And the caller, Adam, is like, oh, well, I'm his son.
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:So, yeah, now we arrive in Wyndham, Minnesota, and the brothers go to.
Speaker A:They are pulling up to cousin Oliver's diner.
Speaker B:And so Cousin Oliver being the nod to the Brady Bunch.
Speaker B:Oh, that's funny.
Speaker A:I didn't notice that.
Speaker A:But I Wasn't afraid.
Speaker B:Told you it was gonna come back.
Speaker B:So they're at cousin Oliver's Hilltop Cafe.
Speaker B:The home of famous pies.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So Sam's already done the research on Adam.
Speaker A:Yeah, he's a real person is what he's established.
Speaker A:He's born in 92.
Speaker A:Mom was Kate.
Speaker A:He didn't have a dad.
Speaker A:He was an Eagle scout.
Speaker A:He's at University of Wisconsin, I think he said.
Speaker B:Yeah, Wisconsin.
Speaker A:Pre med.
Speaker A:Bio.
Speaker A:Pre med student.
Speaker A:And Dan's just kind of like, uh huh.
Speaker A:And digging for weapons in the trunk.
Speaker B:Just like it's a trap.
Speaker B:And look at all these pretty things that are just in my trunk.
Speaker B:Team trunk.
Speaker B:So he comes through and it's just like.
Speaker B:He seemed like he's pulling out the demon knife.
Speaker B:And he is just like, no.
Speaker B:So they go into this diner and there's a table and there's like four empty chairs.
Speaker B:And he does a ganks one of them away and pulls it next to the potted plant, right?
Speaker B:And then the waitress comes over and he's really rude to her and she throws the menu down.
Speaker B:And all I could think about was the meme that was going around this week, which is an old meme, but a good meme of the no hot dog for you.
Speaker B:Of like, I said it to you, I swear to God, I sent you this.
Speaker B:This meme early.
Speaker B:If not, I'll resend it where it's just funny because this guy was rude and there's a waitress pointing at a hot dog and just says, yes, yes.
Speaker B:That's all I can think about.
Speaker B:No hot dog for you.
Speaker A:No hot dog for you.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So, yeah, Dean's completely convinced that this is a demon in a real person's body.
Speaker A:So obviously I'd have to be a real person.
Speaker A:And so he replaces the glass of water for the person meeting them.
Speaker A:Adam with holy water changes out the silverware first.
Speaker B:Actually, no, no, it was holy water.
Speaker B:But what did he call it?
Speaker B:He called it Jesus juice.
Speaker A:Called Jesus juice.
Speaker A:I thought that was wine.
Speaker A:So it's very confusing terminology.
Speaker B:Fair, Fair.
Speaker B:I can see that.
Speaker B:That being confusing.
Speaker B:Jesus juice is typically wine, so also holy water.
Speaker B:Jesus has a lot of juice.
Speaker A:Can you just bless the wine?
Speaker A:I'm just curious.
Speaker A:Okay, never mind.
Speaker B:Is there.
Speaker B:Is there holy wine?
Speaker A:I mean, there is.
Speaker A:I mean, get communion, So I don't know.
Speaker B:But then that's blood.
Speaker B:There's no longer wine.
Speaker B:That's blood.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:All right, well, Dean's just like, look, if he's not a demon, he's a shape shifter.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So he's just absolutely certain that this is.
Speaker A:He's using dad to bait them.
Speaker A:That's it.
Speaker A:And Sam's like, yeah, except that there's this one section of dad's journal that we've never looked at or discussed ever before that's just come to our attention that he went.
Speaker A:Came to Minnesota at this exact timeframe in 92, when this kid was apparently born.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Nine months before he was born.
Speaker A:And then the next two pages of the journal are missing here.
Speaker B:Well, I mean, maybe they just, you know, they didn't look because pages are ripped out.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:And if I saw Minnesota, I'd be like, whatever.
Speaker B:But so that makes Dean think about John having sex and he is grossed out.
Speaker B:Like, everybody is a thought of the parents having sex and then Sam is.
Speaker B:This is a very brotherly moment and just keeps fucking with him.
Speaker B:I do appreciate how Sam is just fucking with him.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker A:So then a guy walks in looking kind of lost, but it's.
Speaker A:It's Adam.
Speaker A:And so he sits down and.
Speaker A:And, you know, they say Sam and Dean basically say they worked together.
Speaker A:And they're like, oh, yeah, we were all mechanics.
Speaker A:Because that was the COVID was that John was a mechanic.
Speaker A:Yeah,.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And so they're like, yeah, dad died on the job.
Speaker A:And he's like, how do you die?
Speaker A:A car fell on him.
Speaker B:It happens, you know.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:But the waitress knows Adam and what he orders.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So Dean does insist, though, that Adam drink the holy water that's on the table.
Speaker B:Very smoothly, very smoothly.
Speaker B:Just like, takes it away.
Speaker B:It's fine.
Speaker B:It's fine.
Speaker B:This.
Speaker B:And he's just like, oh, shit.
Speaker B:Well, but he's at the same time, like, he is tense.
Speaker B:There's so much tension happening here.
Speaker B:I'm like, you just have this gun, like, pointed at somebody underneath the table.
Speaker B:And that also, like, how do you.
Speaker B:How do you not look at that?
Speaker B:Like, I don't know.
Speaker B:That just.
Speaker A:It's a very extreme tension.
Speaker B:How do you know what he's pointing at?
Speaker B:Like, you could be pointing at like the other leg.
Speaker A:Other.
Speaker A:Other.
Speaker A:Other patrons in the restaurant.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:Yeah, like.
Speaker B:Or just like the floor.
Speaker B:Like, you've got to look at.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:So anyways, but so he passes it and Adam's just like, my mom is missing.
Speaker A:And they're like, well, I thought was interesting.
Speaker A:He said when they asked why he called John and he hadn't talked to him in so long.
Speaker A:Why did you call John?
Speaker A:He's like, well, he's the only family I've left, and my mom is missing.
Speaker A:So now, like, I think that that little.
Speaker A:Kind of.
Speaker A:At least for Sam, who's a little bit more believing the story more so than Dean, who's very questioning, kind of was like, oh, shit, we can relate to this.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:And Adam's like, they didn't have a relationship for a long time.
Speaker A:And that John.
Speaker A:Mom was an ER nurse.
Speaker A:John came in from a hunting accident.
Speaker A:And they didn't meet until Adam was 12 years old when mom called after he begged her to.
Speaker A:So kind of sad.
Speaker A:But basically, John didn't even know about him until he was 12, is the way I read this.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah,.
Speaker A:Whatever.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So then, like, you know, Dean's just like, go ahead, eat up.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But Adam passes the silverware test, right?
Speaker B:So at this point, Dean finally, you know, unclenches his sphincter, like, a little bit.
Speaker B:A little bit and uncocks a gun.
Speaker B:But he's still just like that.
Speaker B:But we kind of.
Speaker B:We start learning things about Adam and John's relationship.
Speaker A:And this is making the brothers very unhappy.
Speaker B:Gabby pissed, too.
Speaker B:If my dad.
Speaker B:Like, I spent my entire life with my father where he just basically beat the crap out of me and made me into a soldier who hunts monsters and has to sleep in a motel room.
Speaker A:And for all the important events in my life and didn't give me anything important.
Speaker B:And I go to, like, 9,000 schools.
Speaker B:And then, like, what?
Speaker B:Like, he taught you to play poker?
Speaker B:He taught you to play pool?
Speaker B:Taught you how to drive?
Speaker B:And at that point, I think Dean's had enough.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:In the Impala.
Speaker A:In the Impala.
Speaker B:Taught him how to drive in the Impala.
Speaker B:And we.
Speaker B:We found Dean's limit.
Speaker B:And so Dean finally is just like, you're a liar.
Speaker B:We're his sons.
Speaker A:And poor Adam is so hopeful.
Speaker A:He's like, I have brothers.
Speaker A:And then, no.
Speaker B:And he just pouts off.
Speaker B:And he's just like, whatever.
Speaker B:And Adam was like, no, no, I can prove this.
Speaker B:I can prove this.
Speaker B:So we get back to the house.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So there's photos of Adam and John together.
Speaker A:And the first one is at a baseball game when Adam was 14 years old.
Speaker A:And Sam looks in the journal, and there's a corresponding journal entry on that date that just says Minnesota.
Speaker A:And that's it.
Speaker A:So Dean's pretty upset now because this is another, like, things that he would have loved to have done with his dad that his dad never did with him.
Speaker A:It's a little rough.
Speaker B:It's pretty shitty.
Speaker B:Like, what the fuck?
Speaker B:Like, why can you make time to take this child to the baseball game?
Speaker B:You can shoot stuff and go to a baseball game.
Speaker A:I think he just.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:Life balance.
Speaker A:John Winchester.
Speaker A:So I'm going to shut up on that.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker A:Bad plan.
Speaker A:But yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Well, I will get.
Speaker B:I think we'll see more about this why later.
Speaker B:But like it's.
Speaker B:It's very weird.
Speaker B:I think this is all very, very weird.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:But Sam's just like, all right, let's get back to the point.
Speaker B:Like, why are we here?
Speaker B:What's up with your mom?
Speaker A:Yeah, where's mom?
Speaker A:And he's like, well, mom came home from work and then didn't show up the next day.
Speaker A:The cop searched and find anything, but she wouldn't leave without telling anybody.
Speaker A:It's just like she dropped off the face of the earth, which is suspicious.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Get it?
Speaker B:Sus.
Speaker B:Sus.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So Dean searching the house and finds more photos with John in them.
Speaker A:And it's just like salt in the wound every time, man.
Speaker B:You can see also like this woman did not have a relationship with this man until he was 12.
Speaker A:Yeah, well.
Speaker A:And did they have a relationship after this?
Speaker A:Like was she.
Speaker A:Were they like together?
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:Like why.
Speaker A:Why was his picture on your bedside table?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because it's not just like pictures of Adam and John together.
Speaker B:It's them doing couple shit.
Speaker B:Like there is.
Speaker A:This is clearly like relationship photo on the bedside table.
Speaker A:I'm just saying.
Speaker B:Yeah, like it's weird.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:Do you even like what the fuck?
Speaker B:Like do you have a picture of babe on your.
Speaker B:I guess like you guys have like a wedding picture on the wal.
Speaker B:But it's not like you have like pictures of each like yourself.
Speaker B:Who has a picture of anybody like on there?
Speaker B:Anyways, let's move on.
Speaker B:I'm sorry.
Speaker B:This is going to go down a very long hole.
Speaker B:All right, so where are we at?
Speaker A:No, kind of a break in.
Speaker A:Except for the knocked over end table in the bedroom.
Speaker A:And the Adam's kind of like, why are like, what can you see that the cops didn't see?
Speaker A:He's like, they don't have my eyes, which I thought was pretty funny.
Speaker A:And I'm trying to ask about John, ask about dad.
Speaker A:And Dean doesn't want to talk about.
Speaker A:He's like, trust me, you don't want to know.
Speaker A:So as they're searching, Sam walks up and he's like, there's no information from the cops.
Speaker A:But there was several years ago incident with a bunch of grave robbing with about 17 bodies missing, bodies were found.
Speaker B:That's a lot of bodies.
Speaker A:Yeah, a lot of fucking bodies.
Speaker A:So dad was there to hunt whoever did that is what they pieced together.
Speaker A:And three bodies recently disappeared.
Speaker A:And the word, the term they use, I don't like it.
Speaker A:I don't really.
Speaker A:I mean, other than it's just gross.
Speaker A:But like, grave robbing is awful.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:But corpse snatching, they say.
Speaker A:And I'm like, I don't know why, I don't like that.
Speaker B:I mean, corpse snatching is actually a pretty Victorian term.
Speaker B:So, like, when I go to Scotland in.
Speaker B:In a month, we get to go to the place where the guys who would do like the most infamous grave robberies and they were.
Speaker B:They were corpse snatchers.
Speaker B:And Burke.
Speaker B:And Burke.
Speaker B:And what is Burke's partner's name?
Speaker B:Whatever.
Speaker B:Like the two grave robbing guys in Scotland.
Speaker B:But yeah, corpse snatching, I don't like it.
Speaker B:Anyway, snatch.
Speaker B:Is it because of the snatch?
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:It could be.
Speaker A:I don't really like that word either.
Speaker B:All right, so.
Speaker A:So in addition to Kate, whose mom's missing, Joe Barton is someone else from town that has also recently gone missing.
Speaker B:And he's a local bartender, because that'll.
Speaker A:Come back later, but local bartender.
Speaker A:And so Dean's like, well, does your mom know him?
Speaker A:And as he's asking this, he looks back into the bedroom where they've been talking and searching and sees scratch marks on the floor leading towards under the bed.
Speaker B:On those very nice hardwood floors.
Speaker B:Those actually really pretty florists.
Speaker B:And they.
Speaker B:Yeah, they fucked them up.
Speaker A:They have to resurface that anyways.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker A:And so they're like, son of a bitch.
Speaker A:They pull up the mattress and there's a vent.
Speaker B:To the H Vac.
Speaker B:I'm like, what?
Speaker A:What kind of.
Speaker B:I know this is an old house, but this is not what.
Speaker A:So I guess it's mostly heat, but it still seems very inefficient to have the bed over that.
Speaker A:Like, the heat wouldn't get through them, like, spread out into the window.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I don't know what's happening with this situation, but in your H Vac system.
Speaker A:I'm just saying.
Speaker B:Yeah, this is like someone's going to buy this house in this market because they're just going to snatch it up and they're going to be like, oh, no.
Speaker B:And then like, they're like, why is it my bedroom so hot or so cold?
Speaker B:And then just be like, oh, because My bed is over the vent, but.
Speaker A:It's a massive vent.
Speaker A:The brothers have to do rock, paper, scissors to figure out who goes in.
Speaker A:Nobody's ducks in a residential house are this fucking large.
Speaker A:I'm just saying.
Speaker B:No, those.
Speaker B:That is a good point.
Speaker B:And as I know as I had.
Speaker B:I got a new air conditioner last weekend too, so.
Speaker B:But so they do play rock, paper, scissors, and Sam picks rock and Dean picks scissors.
Speaker B:And I also.
Speaker B:I did love, like, this was a really good moment of just.
Speaker B:Like, this is how in sync we are as brothers.
Speaker B:Like, we just immediately do this.
Speaker B:There's no words.
Speaker B:We just.
Speaker B:I mean.
Speaker B:And Adams.
Speaker B:I think it's that kind of, oh, these are brothers moment.
Speaker A:And for sure, yeah.
Speaker A:Because they, like, as soon as they see the vent, they look at each other, they go straight into rock, paper, scissors.
Speaker A:And then as soon as Dean loses, he knows he's fucked and he gets to crawl in that.
Speaker A:But it was.
Speaker A:I'm like, I'm just still.
Speaker A:Like, you have to have between the upstairs and the downstairs to have a duct that was that big.
Speaker B:Like, that's also between moose and squirrel.
Speaker B:Like, of.
Speaker B:Of Jensen Ackles or Jared Padalecki.
Speaker B:I'm pretty sure every time it would be, sorry, soldier boy.
Speaker B:Like, you were going in the shaft.
Speaker B:Like, you're.
Speaker B:There's no way Sam Winchester is ever fitting in anything that has a word shaft in it.
Speaker B:Like, he's just.
Speaker B:It would stop at his neck.
Speaker B:Like, there's just no way.
Speaker B:He's a large man.
Speaker B:Not that Jensen Ackles is a small man.
Speaker B:We just know in comparison.
Speaker A:Yes, totally speaking.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:So he's crawling through this massive duct work with a gun in his flashlight, and he peeks around a corner and there's a whole lot of blood, chunks of hair, and, like, other tissue.
Speaker A:And it's gross and sad.
Speaker A:And I said, that's sad.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, oh, there's parts of Adam's mom.
Speaker B:So we're going to go to a hotel room.
Speaker B:And at this motel room, one thing I want to point out, as they're scrolling by things we see, basically, there's a car that's advertising happy hour at the Sonny Bono Lounge.
Speaker B:And there is a picture of a mustache person.
Speaker B:And that mustache person was Kim Manners, because Kim had died about a month before this.
Speaker B:So they.
Speaker B:The motel is named the Kelsey Manor KM for Kim man.
Speaker B:And then, like, there's just.
Speaker B:There's all sorts of little kms, like, all throughout this episode, but more most particularly in this motel room.
Speaker B:And so the mustache person in that it looks like Sonny Bono is actually Kim.
Speaker B: t a salute to Supernatural in: Speaker B:So that was happening while this was going on, which I.
Speaker A:That makes my heart go, oh, yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So they're at the motel and Dean is prepping a shotgun.
Speaker A:And Adam shows up and demands to know who they actually are.
Speaker A:He's like, my house is a crime scene, but y' all had to bail before the cops got here, and my mom's probably dead.
Speaker A:What the fuck?
Speaker B:To be fair, though, I will bail before the cops show up.
Speaker B:Like, if that is my option.
Speaker B:See ya.
Speaker B:Like, I would rather not be here.
Speaker B:You can subpoena me later, you know, like, just go.
Speaker B:Cops are coming.
Speaker A:Bye.
Speaker A:Yeah, so they're like, cops thought you saw things that the cops didn't.
Speaker A:And I heard y' all talking about grave robberies.
Speaker A:I want to know what's going on.
Speaker A:And I have figured out that you are not mechanics.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:No mechanics.
Speaker A:So Sam wants to tell him everything.
Speaker A:Sam's ready, But Dean's like, oh, hell no.
Speaker A:But Adam's like, no, I want to.
Speaker A:Like, so this means that all the movie monsters are real?
Speaker A:Is that what you're saying?
Speaker B:So he's getting the talk, right?
Speaker B:Like, the talk they give to everybody.
Speaker B:But this one happens to be their brother, right?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:He's like, oh, so the movie monsters are real?
Speaker A:And Dean's like, except for Godzilla.
Speaker A:That's just a movie.
Speaker B:How do you know?
Speaker B:I love how they always pick, like, which monster isn't real.
Speaker B:And this time it's like, Godzilla.
Speaker B:I'm like, you don't know?
Speaker B:You're not in Japan That.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Come on.
Speaker A:Sam's like, no, yeah, we.
Speaker A:We hunt them.
Speaker A:And so did dad.
Speaker A:That's the thing.
Speaker A:And Dean's like, you're way too accepting of this.
Speaker B:This.
Speaker A:Usually you're, like, freaking out or calling us crazy by now, so.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:But basically, Sam and Dean are gonna go hunt whoever did this.
Speaker A:Adam's like, I want to help too.
Speaker A:And so.
Speaker A:But Dean is really against this because Dean now has come.
Speaker A:I'm not saying that he's okay with the difference in treatment between Adam and Sam and Dean, but his supposition from the situation is that John was protecting Adam from their life.
Speaker A:That's why he ripped the pages from the journal.
Speaker A:That's why he didn't want.
Speaker A:He didn't want Adam to have their life.
Speaker A:And we need to respect John's wishes and not rope him into this shit,.
Speaker B:Which seem, you know.
Speaker B:And as we will discuss as we get further this episode, I think is probably projecting somebody maybe projecting his own feelings.
Speaker B:So he storms out like a little bitch at the beginning.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:A lot of this.
Speaker B:There's a lot of Dean being a.
Speaker A:Bitch and there's a lot of Dean feelings.
Speaker B:There's a lot of, you know, Dean not dealing with his feelings.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So only 88.
Speaker B:Maybe this will be the 89th fan fiction where, you know, someone writes Dean, if you rewrite this, a Dean dealing with his feelings.
Speaker B:That is going to happen.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:So Sam and Adam are alone together and Sam's just like, I'm going to start showing you how to do things.
Speaker B:Here's a gun.
Speaker A:Yeah, because that's what you do is you hand someone a pistol immediately that doesn't know anything about this stuff.
Speaker B:But obviously the pistol that you just loaded just like.
Speaker B:Did he unload it?
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:It's just like, here is my.45, which is not the most, like, this is the gun that I'm going to start you off with.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:We'll get more into, like, Sam's.
Speaker B:I actually have other commentary on Sam's shooting skills abilities.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:La, la, la, la, la.
Speaker B:But then we get into some deep.
Speaker A:Feelings here because Sam's just like, Adam wants revenge.
Speaker A:And Sam's like, I know what it's like to want revenge.
Speaker B:Fair.
Speaker B:Fair.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I can see this empathy happening back and forth.
Speaker B:But then we get to meet the most amazing character ever.
Speaker B:He's literally in here for three seconds.
Speaker B:I just love this undertaker.
Speaker B:Like, he is such an undertaker.
Speaker B:He is like the undertaker in the Muppets where the undertaker is, like, singing, I'm so happy.
Speaker B:Like my favorite Muppets scene of all time.
Speaker B:That is this undertaker or funeral director, whatever.
Speaker A:And Dean's there pretending to be Agent Nugent and talking about the missing corpses.
Speaker A:And I like that he asks.
Speaker A:Dean asks the more whatever.
Speaker A:He is the funeral directorial director.
Speaker B:What this?
Speaker A:What?
Speaker A:Who.
Speaker A:Who he thinks did it.
Speaker A:And he says, sick, deranged hooligans.
Speaker B:Hooligans.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I'm just like, yeah, a month till I get to officially be in England to be a hooligan.
Speaker B:Because that is.
Speaker B:Oh, man, there's me a hooliganism happening.
Speaker B:All right, so.
Speaker B:But Dean's just like, what is this group?
Speaker A:There's goop.
Speaker A:There's goop.
Speaker A:And it's embalming fluid, so.
Speaker A:And not blood on the ground.
Speaker A:But apparently they quote, unquote, opened them up.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:And now I'm kind of kicking myself because I should have looked up because now I want to know if embalming fluid is goopy.
Speaker A:I mean, it wasn't like super goopy, but it was like definitely like syrupy texture, probably.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, can you see it in TV films?
Speaker B:It's usually kind of like green, but I. I don't know.
Speaker B:Now I want to know what it is.
Speaker B:But anyway, so we're going to cut to a bar.
Speaker A:Is it weird that I'm kind of surprised you couldn't just tell me that what it was off the top of your head?
Speaker A:No, I'm not disappointed, Liz, but I'm surprised.
Speaker A:I'm just saying.
Speaker B:I mean, if you look, I'm pretty sure there is.
Speaker B:Yeah, Everlasting bombing fluids.
Speaker A:I think I was there when you got your embalming sign, wasn't it?
Speaker B:But it doesn't say on there if it's goopy.
Speaker A:It doesn't describe it.
Speaker A:Okay, noted.
Speaker B:Just to say the most goopiest of embalming fluid.
Speaker B:And there's also a bumper sticker that says Embalmer Hun.
Speaker B:Like that's also back on the wall that I got at this great shop in Baltimore.
Speaker B:Because in Baltimore they say Baltimore Hun.
Speaker B:Like the Hun is the thing.
Speaker B:H O N. But they just took out Baltimore and they put embalmer.
Speaker B:Okay, spooky.
Speaker A:All right, so bar dean's at a bar and the bartender says, first beers on the house for cops and feds.
Speaker A:So she assumes that he's a fed.
Speaker A:He's sitting there looking at notes and ends up that bartender.
Speaker A:Lisa was Joe Barton's wife.
Speaker A:The gentleman, the bartender that disappeared.
Speaker A:And he stayed late to the inventory and never came home.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker B:Yeah, it would suck.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:But back in the day, he was a deputy in the.
Speaker A:In their town and did work the grave robbing case.
Speaker A:He found in the picture.
Speaker B:Yeah, in the picture of him, he has the deputy est of hats.
Speaker B:Like it is like.
Speaker B:No, like, unless you're a Mountie.
Speaker B:Like you don't like.
Speaker B:That was a deadly do little hat.
Speaker B:It was spectacular.
Speaker A:Yeah, no, totally.
Speaker A:But there's the picture from when they.
Speaker A:The newspaper article picture they.
Speaker A:They found goes with this.
Speaker A:You can see John in the background and obviously this deputies in it.
Speaker A:And he's like, yeah, he had help from a specialist.
Speaker A:And you know, the cops never figured out, you know, who took the bodies.
Speaker A:But Joe told us that they told me that they took care of what done it.
Speaker A:What done it?
Speaker A:What done it.
Speaker B:We did it.
Speaker B:What done it.
Speaker B:We Took care of it.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker A:All right, so now we know that we've got further confirmation that John was definitely there hunting something at that time and help.
Speaker A:And had law enforcement help, basically, then, right?
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, somebody helped.
Speaker B:But, yeah, there was something that was going on.
Speaker B:All right, so we're gonna go back to the motel because we get a lot of cuts going in this.
Speaker B:And so now Adam knows how to clean gun.
Speaker A:Yeah, this is a very quick training.
Speaker A:I'm just saying.
Speaker A:He picks this up super snappy.
Speaker B:I mean, to be fair, like, Sam could have broken it down and then, like, just rub oil on this part.
Speaker A:That's fair.
Speaker B:But it's true, you know, like, from, like, a gun safety thing.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:I think you should be able to take apart and put together whatever gun you have.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Agreed.
Speaker B:This is actually not bad training, but just.
Speaker A:It's just very accelerated training in general.
Speaker B:And it's also not effective.
Speaker B:Like, is like, do you need to clean the gun before whatever this is?
Speaker B:Anyways.
Speaker A:All right, so, yeah, so they're cleaning guns.
Speaker A:I think I literally wrote playing with guns is what I wrote down, by the way, because that's how I felt about at this point.
Speaker A:I'm like, oh, they're just gonna play with guns now.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:But Adam wants to know how John actually died.
Speaker A:And so Sam tells him it was a demon and that Dean killed it.
Speaker A:And so Adam's like, well, then your revenge is over then.
Speaker B:And Sam.
Speaker A:Sam says, it's never over.
Speaker A:It's never over.
Speaker B:And we're getting some weird shit from, like, Sam's starting going weirder and weirder as we hear this.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And then the power goes out and you hear weird scratchy noises in.
Speaker A:In the place.
Speaker A:So Sam gets a shotgun and, like, clears the bathroom.
Speaker A:And I'm dying, by the way, during this point.
Speaker A:It's like Diana's shower curtains waving in the wind.
Speaker A:Why is the bathroom window open in fucking Minnesota?
Speaker A:I am not happy in this scene.
Speaker A:So they hear all this clanking around in the vents and ducks and so, like, son of a bitch.
Speaker A:Whatever got.
Speaker A:Whatever got.
Speaker A:Mom is after them.
Speaker A:So they go to the car.
Speaker A:Well, they run out to Adam's truck,.
Speaker B:Which, as in Winchester fashion, is a solid truck, very cool truck.
Speaker A:And as they get to it, they're getting ready to try to open the door because Sam's going to drive and something grabs his fucking feet.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Not a fan of things grabbing feet.
Speaker B:No, stop.
Speaker B:I just don't like it.
Speaker B:And no, not a fan.
Speaker B:This is because there's nothing I can do about it.
Speaker B:Oh, unless I look under every thing that I ever get into.
Speaker A:Like, and that's.
Speaker A:I don't like bending down that far.
Speaker A:It's really hard to get down that.
Speaker B:Low anymore if you're in a skirt.
Speaker B:And you know, I mean, I mean I granted it's not that far from me to go, but like once I've like been down, then it becomes a tortoise situation and you know, it's.
Speaker B:Sometimes I can't get back up, you know, so.
Speaker B:But anyway, so yeah, he's.
Speaker B:Something's trying to drag him under and then all of a sudden he pulls.
Speaker A:Up right as Adam's finally making it around the.
Speaker A:Finally coming around to help.
Speaker A:Dean pulls up and they are able together to pull Sam out from underneath.
Speaker B:And as Adam yells, he's like, dean, help.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And Dean shoots, blindly shoots the shotgun under the truck.
Speaker A:And they move the truck and what's underneath?
Speaker A:It's a storm drain with the lid half removed.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker B:We got an over manhole.
Speaker B:Stop shooting at things you can't see because what the fuck are you shooting at?
Speaker B:Like, how did you not shoot Sam's whatever.
Speaker B:Like, don't like this.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:And there's a blood at the hole.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So, yeah, no one saw it, but they figure out that what targets are.
Speaker A:Basically, it wants revenge for something.
Speaker A:And so there we go.
Speaker B:Yeah, we've got a pattern, right?
Speaker B:It's going after like these things and it wants revenge, revenge, revenge.
Speaker A:So they go back to the house and they're like, Dean get.
Speaker A:Dean tells Adam, get your shit, you're getting the fuck out of here.
Speaker A:We're going to drop you at Bobby's and we're going to come back and finish this whole thing off.
Speaker A:Sam's like, oh, hell no.
Speaker A:We all need to stay.
Speaker A:We have no other leads or witnesses.
Speaker A:And basically they're going to use Adam as bait because why not?
Speaker A:They'll train him, it's fine.
Speaker B:And he's also saying like, this is kind of like when they like as we've been prepping for Dark side Sam.
Speaker B:Like, he's just like, oh no.
Speaker B:Like, why would we go.
Speaker B:We have bait.
Speaker B:Like, we'll just use this brand new brother we found as bait for this thing.
Speaker B:We don't know what it is.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, no, it is kind of dark.
Speaker A:But also I kind of get like,.
Speaker B:I mean, this kid is logical.
Speaker B:It's fucking logical.
Speaker B:I agree.
Speaker A:And the kid's an adult and if he wants to stay and help, it's kind of like hard to like, no.
Speaker B:At the same time from a. I just met a.
Speaker B:This would be me.
Speaker B:If I would.
Speaker B:I would be Dean.
Speaker B:I would be like, no, no, no.
Speaker B:New guy, not trained, doesn't know shit.
Speaker B:We go put new guy away, then the people who are trained in handling shit go handle shit.
Speaker B:Then we come back and get new guy.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Oh, wait, do I sound like that's what I do every day?
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:But Adam has.
Speaker A:Wants no part of that.
Speaker A:He wants to.
Speaker A:He wants to do whatever it takes to get revenge.
Speaker A:He's down.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Yeehaw.
Speaker A:And so Sam and Adam go.
Speaker A:Go shoot in the woods.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:So Sam is teaching Adam to shoot.
Speaker B:And Adam's fucking teacupping.
Speaker B:And I'm like, what?
Speaker A:No.
Speaker B:Like, this is.
Speaker B:You are terrible.
Speaker B:Well, also, we know Sam can't shoot for shit.
Speaker B:Why is Dean not teaching Adam to shoot?
Speaker A:I don't want to have any part of this.
Speaker A:But that's also.
Speaker A:At this point, if it's going to happen, you might as well just fucking help and do it right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because I.
Speaker B:If I was Dean, I'd be like, what.
Speaker B:What are you doing?
Speaker B:No, just move.
Speaker B:Move.
Speaker A:And so they're given like this like absurd, like, like two hour crash course in monsters.
Speaker A:What it feels like to poor Adam.
Speaker A:Like, all right, first we're gonna shoot guns, then we're gonna read this book.
Speaker A:And then I'm gon.
Speaker A:And then we're going to.
Speaker B:And I was thinking though, as they were flipping through books and I'm looking at them, I was like, man, they should have just gotten the Carver Edlin books and then just given those to Adam.
Speaker B:And then Adam would have had like the entire breakdown of their lives the past two years.
Speaker B:And how to hunt.
Speaker A:Missed opportunity.
Speaker A:Missed opportunity.
Speaker B:Right there.
Speaker B:It was.
Speaker B:It was right there.
Speaker B:Guys like, you know, that may long.
Speaker A:I don't know, who knows?
Speaker A:This seemed like pretty fast, but Adam called it a job.
Speaker A:And Sam, it's kind of defensive.
Speaker A:He's like, it's not.
Speaker A:It's a life.
Speaker A:And Sam, this is where you really kind of see like we were.
Speaker A:You've been talking about like this build up.
Speaker A:They've been giving him kind of this darker side to Sam.
Speaker A:And it's like, you know, you can't have a job, no girlfriend, no friends.
Speaker A:You can't have any connections.
Speaker A:It's the price we pay.
Speaker A:The only.
Speaker A:But you can only count on family.
Speaker A:And Dean's like kind of pissed.
Speaker A:Like, he's like, what are you talking about?
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:But Dean was kind of like that before.
Speaker A:It's kind of weird, but we're going.
Speaker B:To start seeing, like, kind of like.
Speaker B:I don't know, listen, there's a lot of projection happening here, but, you know, so Dean's just like, whoa, like, John said the same thing to you and.
Speaker A:That's what made you pissed and leave.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And now he's just like, okay, like, maybe, maybe I see your point from back then.
Speaker B:And then Sam says something that is very disturbing because he says, when I look at Adam, all I see is the meet.
Speaker A:Yikes.
Speaker B:Yikes.
Speaker B:Like, this is.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:That's dark.
Speaker A:And Dean's like, you know, Sam's like, dad taught us to protect ourselves.
Speaker A:Dean's like, it's too late for us, but Adam has a chance at a normal life in school and all that.
Speaker A:And so basically that's where we, you know, really is basically vocalizing that he's jealous.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:That's his way of saying it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And Sam and Jeans is like, you know, let's give Adam this chance.
Speaker B:And Sam, like, he's five years old is like, what makes Adam so special.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Don't like it.
Speaker B:Don't like it.
Speaker A:Oh, like, he's a Winchester.
Speaker A:So he's already cursed.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And that's also just like he's a Winchester.
Speaker B:He's already cursed.
Speaker B:Ooh.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then Dean's finally just like, nap that over this.
Speaker B:I'm just gonna go find this.
Speaker A:I'm gonna find this.
Speaker A:I'm gonna go find the monster.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So he's back at the mausoleum alone now.
Speaker B:Oh, and we also get some.
Speaker B:Vroom, vroom.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:So like, baby's like, we're gonna go find this fucker.
Speaker B:Like, I do it.
Speaker B:I appreciate a good.
Speaker B:Baby is like off of the hunt.
Speaker A:Impressive room.
Speaker A:So he goes back to the mausoleum.
Speaker A:He's alone in the mausoleum with a flashlight.
Speaker A:And I'm covering my eyes at time the same point, just so you know, because that's what I do.
Speaker A:And he sees a draft, moving some cobwebs and is able to clear a stone out of the way so that you can crawl down into a lower crypt and decides to crawl in.
Speaker A:And Nope.
Speaker A:Is all I have to say about that.
Speaker A:Nope.
Speaker B:So what?
Speaker B:I'm just saying nope.
Speaker B:Because my abs are really sore right now.
Speaker B:So, like, there is so much belly crawling that is happening.
Speaker B:And Diana, being a woman who was in the military, has done a lot, I'm sure belly crawling.
Speaker B:And I have paid to do it in tough mudders as I'm an idiot.
Speaker B:But yeah, my abs are Hurting during this.
Speaker B:And also, why are there cobwebs if things have come out of whatever, so.
Speaker B:But he gets my.
Speaker B:My, like, the moment that I would die for because I'm like, oh, I'm in this.
Speaker B: This crypt that was built in: Speaker B:I just went down a tunnel and found another crypt.
Speaker B:More funeral shit.
Speaker B:Yes, yes.
Speaker A:And it's pretty torn up in there.
Speaker A:It is not like something has been fucking up this crypt.
Speaker A:And there's a very, very fresh body.
Speaker A:And he finds glasses on the ground.
Speaker A:So we know now this is Joe the bartender.
Speaker A:And decent sloppy Joe.
Speaker B:Yeah, bad pun, but also funny.
Speaker B:And so then he hears a noise,.
Speaker A:And I'm freaking out once again.
Speaker A:I'm covering my eyes.
Speaker A:So he shoots blindly into the passage, kind of.
Speaker B:Why is there so much as I'm blindly shooting my gun at things during this episode?
Speaker B:Because this seems stupid, as we learn is stupid.
Speaker A:Very stupid.
Speaker A:So tunnel collapses, and he has no cell service.
Speaker A:Now he's trapped.
Speaker A:In the script.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Son of a bitch.
Speaker A:Which gives me, like, super, Like, I am not, like, a hyper claustrophobic person.
Speaker A:Don't get me wrong.
Speaker A:I think I have the same, like, level of claustrophobia as an average human.
Speaker A:Where, like, I don't.
Speaker A:I mean, I don't want to be buried alive.
Speaker A:I don't want to be in a small room with no escape.
Speaker A:Like, I think, like, a healthy level of claustrophobia.
Speaker A:This kind of shit freaks me out.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:No, I mean, the tunnel crawling freaks me out.
Speaker B:Just because as a fat chick, I'm afraid I'm gonna get stuck.
Speaker B:Or just, like, my boobs will just like, this is awesome leg.
Speaker B:I could never, like, stomach crawl, like, with these tits.
Speaker B:Like, they would just, like.
Speaker B:Do you know how hard it would be?
Speaker B:Like, you'd have to be able to lift one up and then the other.
Speaker B:And, like, so you need clearance above you to actually get through the space like that.
Speaker B:That.
Speaker B:I guess this is why Dean is doing it.
Speaker B:But anyway, so I. I get it.
Speaker B:But at least, like, the crypt that he's in, like, there's space in there.
Speaker B:He's not, like, stuck in the tunnel.
Speaker A:Like, oh, still upsetting.
Speaker A:All right, so back at the house, Sam is showing Adam how to cover all events and salt all of the entries to the house.
Speaker B:We don't know what this is.
Speaker B:We'll just throw hands off.
Speaker A:Except one.
Speaker A:La, la, la.
Speaker A:They want to force whatever is in the vents to come at Adam through that one hole.
Speaker B:But tactically makes sense.
Speaker A:It does.
Speaker A:There's a very smart tactic Actually.
Speaker A:But then the woman's.
Speaker A:They hear a creaking door.
Speaker A:Someone came into the house downstairs.
Speaker A:And a woman's voice is calling for Adam.
Speaker A:Oh, no, it's mom's voice.
Speaker A:Sam tries to stop him, though.
Speaker B:Not your mom.
Speaker A:Not your mom.
Speaker A:They go downstairs and mom looks pretty, like, fucked up, kind of injured.
Speaker A:And Sam just keeps telling Adam, wait, it's not your mom.
Speaker A:It's not your mom.
Speaker A:And I'm like.
Speaker A:And she's like, no, I totally got away.
Speaker A:And they're hugging and I'm like, oh, I don't fucking trust this.
Speaker A:This is all bad.
Speaker A:And it's all upsetting and it's all sad.
Speaker A:This is upsetting.
Speaker A:Like, this is upsetting.
Speaker A:I just want to be really clear, this whole thing, because it gets worse.
Speaker A:So Sam has a shotgun, says, that's not your mother.
Speaker A:Step away.
Speaker A:And we cut back real fast because they have to do this.
Speaker A:While your suspense is super high.
Speaker A:We go back to Dean, trying to find a route to get out of the crypt.
Speaker A:And there's a whole lot of bones in an intact coffin.
Speaker A:And he opens it, gags.
Speaker A:And it's definitely a disemboweled Kate, AKA there's mom.
Speaker A:We know the mom standing in the kitchen with Adam.
Speaker A:And Sam is definitely not her.
Speaker A:So Adam's like, oh, I'm so sure it's my mom.
Speaker A:Sam's like, no, it can't be.
Speaker A:There's too much blood in the vent.
Speaker B:Your mom's dead.
Speaker A:And Adam gets the shotgun from Sam.
Speaker A:And I'm like, really?
Speaker A:Sam?
Speaker A:How the fuck did you let this untrained get your shotgun?
Speaker A:Oh, so mad.
Speaker B:Well, I mean, a long arm takedown is actually like, easier.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Yeah, I can see that.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:But to be fair, like, Adam now has a gun.
Speaker B:And Sam's just like, well, shoot it.
Speaker B:It's not human.
Speaker A:And he winks at his mom and says, I know, and butt checks Sam in the face.
Speaker B:Okay, so.
Speaker A:That's all I got.
Speaker A:I was so upset.
Speaker B:So I'm just like, up until this point, you didn't know, did you?
Speaker A:No.
Speaker B:I love, like, you like his supernatural version.
Speaker B:It's so wonderful.
Speaker B:There's like, even all the things that you know that you didn't know.
Speaker B:But this wasn't Adam.
Speaker B:Adam was dead.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:But that's not happy.
Speaker B:I'm very upset about all this.
Speaker A:Well, processing this potential surprise new brother, this whole episode, and reevaluating their entire family dynamic.
Speaker A:And this kid is processing.
Speaker A:They're helping this kid process.
Speaker A:Fake process his mother's death at the hands of something supernatural and trusting his need potential, you know?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:He thought they were helping him do that.
Speaker A:And, like, all this and.
Speaker B:Well, and the.
Speaker B:But they.
Speaker B:But this is what I love about having the virgin viewer, though, is that this was happening when this was, you know, coming out on air.
Speaker B:Muslim talked about the beginning with the jump, the shark thing that out.
Speaker A:I'm sure.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:The people were, like, losing their shit online that they were adding this third Winchester brother.
Speaker B:Like, nobody knew what was going on.
Speaker B:And they did this and they flipped it.
Speaker B:And I think it's fucking brilliant as far as tv, like, drama goes, to do this.
Speaker B:Like, I hate this episode.
Speaker B:Still a fucking, like, brilliant move.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well, now we see Dean back in the crypt and he opens another coffin and it's disemboweled Adam.
Speaker A:So now we know that the Adam, Adam and Mom that are with Sam are definitely not Adam and Kate.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So there's some real creepy humming as Sam wakes up to being tied up on the table.
Speaker B:Oh, wait, wait.
Speaker B:Before we get to that, there is.
Speaker B:Dean gets into his, super determined to get out.
Speaker B:And the way out that he sees is a stained glass window with an angel on it.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, you're winking at him.
Speaker B:There is a winking angel.
Speaker A:I didn't.
Speaker A:I saw it, but I didn't think about it.
Speaker A:Oh, that's good.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:All right, so now we cut to Sam being tied up on our table.
Speaker A:And creepy fucking humming.
Speaker A:So Sam.
Speaker B:Yeah, humming is always creepy.
Speaker B:Like, it's just always.
Speaker B:Don't hum, people.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's weird.
Speaker A:It's gross.
Speaker B:I don't like it.
Speaker A:Well, Sam has figured out that they are ghouls, not shape shifters.
Speaker A:And Kate says that that term is racist.
Speaker B:And then she sniffs him and she licks him.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And calling him fresh meat.
Speaker A:And he just starts.
Speaker A:Basically, this gives Sam the opportunity to give his lore at this point because he's just like.
Speaker A:Well, usually ghouls are scavengers.
Speaker A:Because it's just kind of.
Speaker A:I'm just gonna say, like, I get that he was kind of trying to figure out what's going on, but it also is kind of funny.
Speaker A:Like, how are we going to explain this monster?
Speaker A:Okay, Sam's tied up, and before they eat him, we will have him explain what they're doing.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:It's just kind of funny to me.
Speaker A:But that ghouls are usually scavengers.
Speaker A:And then they take on the appearance of the last corpse that they take down.
Speaker A:But they don't usually go for the living.
Speaker A:And Adams reveals that they actually get the thoughts and memories as well.
Speaker A:I was like, okay, this is really sad and dark.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:And then Kate says, well, we are what we eat, which is a good one, but.
Speaker B:So we had Sam's lore on ghouls.
Speaker B:I was lore on ghouls.
Speaker B:And also ghouls.
Speaker B:And so when I hear the word ghouls, all I can think about is there is a Family Guy episode where they have, like, Mrs. Garrett and she's saying, girls, girls, girls.
Speaker B:I'm pretty sure that was in Family Guy, but all I can think about is that voice going, ghouls, ghouls, ghouls.
Speaker B:So that is what I think about when I hear ghouls.
Speaker B:I love ghouls, because.
Speaker B:So if you can't from what, like, they have in this episode, ghouls, like, are kind of like zombies cousins in terms of just, like, reanimated corpses.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:But the one that we're really going to talk about, where it comes from are the Arabic version of the ghouls.
Speaker B:That is really where we all think everything comes from.
Speaker B:Because.
Speaker B:Because the legends of ghouls are really old, like, and pre Islamic old.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But most of our legends, like I said, come from Arabic lore.
Speaker B:But the large thought is that, at least linguistically, the term probably derived from Mesopotamian culture because they had the word galu, G, A, L, L, U, which was a demon of the underworld that went down and, like, abducted a vegetable.
Speaker B:Vegetable God and took the vegetable God to death.
Speaker B:I don't know Mesopotamians.
Speaker B:They had veggie gods, whatever.
Speaker B:I really hope it was a very angry carrot.
Speaker A:Like, is it a beat?
Speaker B:It could be, because I tried really hard to find beats this weekend, and the only beats I could find were, like, massive beats.
Speaker B:And I was like, no, those don't look like.
Speaker B:I'm not opposed to gmo.
Speaker B:But I was like, you're suspicious.
Speaker B:Like, beets shouldn't be this large.
Speaker B:So I don't trust where you were grown.
Speaker A:So it's that vegetable God.
Speaker B:Anyway, yeah, they were that.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker B:So we're just gonna.
Speaker B:I'm gonna keep the.
Speaker B:The legend really focused around the Arabic ghouls.
Speaker B:They do come into, like, a more Western culture later.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:So this kind of covers most of the areas we're talking about in this episode.
Speaker B:So typically, ghouls can be found in deserted areas, like cemeteries and abandoned buildings, things.
Speaker B:So I'm.
Speaker B:I'm feeling some sympathy with these guys.
Speaker B:I'm like, cool, cool.
Speaker B:Don't be.
Speaker B:Want to be around people.
Speaker B:Want to hang out in cemeteries.
Speaker A:You're like, that's where I hang out.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But what do they look like?
Speaker B:They were often represented as an ugly female creature that was, like, hunched, walking on, like, two legs.
Speaker B:But sometimes they could run on four limbs.
Speaker B:Often described as having cloven hooves, fangs, and mouths that looked like cat smells, which I'm not really sure what that description and I'll get into kind of.
Speaker B:But that is like, actually, like, describes like.
Speaker B:Like a cat's mouth.
Speaker B:And I'm like, my cat doesn't have lips.
Speaker B:So like, I. Yeah, I guess this is kind of like the lipless mouth.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:I don't know, the whisker things.
Speaker B:They like to eat children the best, but they'll pretty much, you know, eat any people they'll find.
Speaker B:Particularly though they like travelers and groups.
Speaker B:So there is a very recurring theme of basically, like, you're on a road in the desert, and then you come across this ghoul.
Speaker B:Then they're going to ask you for help, and they're like, can I ride on your camel?
Speaker B:And you'll be like, sure.
Speaker B:And then they're like, wait, they're going to stop here and we're going to eat you.
Speaker B:Like, so.
Speaker B:But, you know, a lot of this comes from, I'm alone in the desert and now I found this thing.
Speaker B:Or I'm alone in the cemetery and I found this thing.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:They are, like, thought to be shape shifters.
Speaker B:So like we see in the episode.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But they particularly like to look like beautiful women to take advantage of men's inability to keep their dicks in their pants, which seems to be a lot of themes for a lot of our religion is just.
Speaker B:Men are horny, so we're gonna.
Speaker B:This demon is gonna look like a chick, so you want to fuck it, and that is gonna lead you astray.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Because you were thinking with your.
Speaker B:All right, so one thing about the shape shifting, though, a lot of them say, like, even if they shape shifted into a beautiful woman, they would still have the legs of, like, a donkey or, like, goat.
Speaker B:Usually a donkey, though, so an ass.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But it's like, well, we.
Speaker B:I can change everything to here.
Speaker B:So, like, if you lift up your skirt and there's like, donkey legs, it's probably not a woman.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:I mean, that's pro tip.
Speaker B:Maybe.
Speaker B:I mean, I'm not gonna yuck your yum if you just like to, you know, put on donkey legs.
Speaker B:But, you know, anyways, so there are also some stories in which the ghoul, like, wasn't like, a dangerous thing.
Speaker B:It was just like, hey, like, this is just this other creature.
Speaker B:Sometimes people married them.
Speaker B:There is a example of a story from, like, 932ce where this guy was like, yeah, you know, there's this ghoul just living amongst this tribe until, like, they had a baby ghoul, and it's all lightning, and it got sad and wanted to go home.
Speaker B:And that was how we know that, like, sometimes people just fucked and married ghouls, you know, sometimes you just hang out with them.
Speaker B:You know, it happens.
Speaker B:This is another one of my favorite, like, Arabic tales, just to get that deep feeling of what it's like, because apparently a lot of the stories have to to do with peeing.
Speaker B:All right, so there was a man, and he saw a ram in the desert, and he carried it under his arm.
Speaker B:After catching the ram, I don't know why he had to catch the ramp, but he caught the ramp.
Speaker B:So he's running with it, and as he's running with this ram, it keeps peeing.
Speaker B:And as the weight of the ram kept getting bigger as, like, he approached the house.
Speaker B:So the ram is growing in size and peeing a lot, right?
Speaker B:So finally he, like, just gives up and let's go.
Speaker B:And so it changes into a ghoul.
Speaker B:And then later, they're asking, well, why did you carry it under your arm?
Speaker B:And the man just replied, evil.
Speaker A:Well, that's creepy.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, I like it.
Speaker B:So sometimes you just carry a ram under your arm for evil.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But it just keeps being everywhere.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker A:Keep peeing everywhere on you.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker B:So there's another story, and this was two men from a tribe.
Speaker B:They wanted to give their bribe her bribe their bride, her wedding outfits, right?
Speaker B:Because she's a chick, and she's like, yeah, I want to look pretty for you.
Speaker B:My wedding day.
Speaker B:So they go on a trip, right?
Speaker B:And there on the strip, they see this lonely woman.
Speaker B:And upon seeing them, the woman said, what is your need?
Speaker B:And the men replied, well, you want to provide a bride with her needs.
Speaker B:And she said, I could help you if you promise to come back to me.
Speaker B:So they're like, of course.
Speaker B:Of course.
Speaker B:We'll come back.
Speaker B:So they finished her business, and they come back to her, and she said, I will follow you in her your journey.
Speaker B:And they make her ride one of their camels.
Speaker B:And they reach a sound mound, a sand mound so big, a big desert thing in the desert.
Speaker B:And then she's like, I have some business here.
Speaker B:And they just thought she had to pee.
Speaker B:So she goes off.
Speaker B:Off to pee, but after an hour, they're like, what the fuck is happening?
Speaker B:And so.
Speaker B:But now they realize one of the other guys are gone, and they come back, and the woman's just lying on his belly and eating his liver.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so uni business.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:And so then the other guy runs away.
Speaker B:And then someone's like, why are you running?
Speaker B:And he's like, there's a devil among us.
Speaker B:And then they're like, okay.
Speaker B:And then he goes back to the woman that was eating their friends and was just like, look, if you.
Speaker B:If you just want to avoid this, like, in the future, you just have to talk about God.
Speaker B:And so they're like, yeah, all right.
Speaker B:So, hey, God, can you help us?
Speaker B:And then lightning came from the sky, and it killed the ghoul.
Speaker B:And that is how you kill them, is you ask for help from God.
Speaker B:After she's done peeing, I guess.
Speaker A:So after she pees, you ask God for help, and then it strikes down the ghoul with lightning.
Speaker B:Yeah, I guess.
Speaker B:I. Yeah, I mean, clear as mud, right?
Speaker B:Like that.
Speaker B:We get this is.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's just the simplest.
Speaker A:Sometimes the simplest answer is, yeah.
Speaker B:The other thing is, like, if you get into a fight with them, like, you can't, like, hit them more than once.
Speaker B:Like, you have to, like, kill them, like, on the first blow.
Speaker B:Because if you hit it a second time, then it comes back to life.
Speaker B:So, like, if you hit it once, just let it be.
Speaker B:Don't keep hitting it, like, as we see somebody do in this episode.
Speaker B:So, like, you hit it once and just let it go, and then you walk away.
Speaker B:All right, so just to wrap this up, are ghouls real?
Speaker B:Well, so pretty much think about this fact.
Speaker B:We have the story of people who are wandering the desert, getting really tired and horny and seeing pretty women appear to them and tell them to do things.
Speaker B:I think we can kind of figure out where this legend probably started of sad, lonely men wandering, getting attacked by things.
Speaker B:Also the physical descriptions of it.
Speaker B:So things like the cat's mouth, people think could maybe be, like, a cleft palate.
Speaker B:That could explain it.
Speaker B:And they thought maybe it is a way.
Speaker A:What was that?
Speaker A:And real weird teeth and real world.
Speaker B:Teeth and fangs and stuff.
Speaker B:But one of the reasons I think they may have needed to have this is because of all the inbreeding that was happening in the desert and then people coming out deformed.
Speaker B:Because that is what happens when you people.
Speaker A:You're related to.
Speaker B:So as a way, like, it was kind of like, hey, you shouldn't interbreed.
Speaker B:Because that was like, one of the main themes, too, is like, you know, like, the gold.
Speaker B:Like, you're intermarried.
Speaker B:And then, like, you shouldn't do that.
Speaker B:And maybe it's kind of like, well, these traits are pretty bad.
Speaker B:Stop fucking them.
Speaker B:But also, it's a really bad way to, I guess, distance yourself from the physically deformed.
Speaker B:And it's all not good.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:None of this is good.
Speaker B:But I will say, I think the most poetic and possibly like, the metaphoric description of ghouls that I saw, because there's a lot of, you know, especially in a lot of, like, Arabic lore, there's a lot of poetry that's involved in it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And there I like this idea that ghouls are like mirages in the desert because they don't stay the same.
Speaker B:That's what shapeshifters are like.
Speaker B:They're like the mirage.
Speaker B:Like, they're never the same.
Speaker B:They're always changing.
Speaker B:And there was a poet who said, no condition lasts forever, for it changes.
Speaker B:Like, changing shape of the ghouls.
Speaker B:And I just thought that was, you know, as weird as this is.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So sometimes they eat people in cemeteries, sometimes they don't.
Speaker B:Like, they're scavengers of the dead.
Speaker B:Is something that was a Western influence later.
Speaker B:Like, I think in general, like, the Arabic ghouls just would eat whatever.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, you could be dead, you could be alive, whatever.
Speaker B:As kind of like as Kate and Adam.
Speaker B:Ghoul Kate and Adam evolved in this episode.
Speaker B:They learned that, too.
Speaker A:My notes had to change because I was like, yeah, so let's.
Speaker B:Let's go back to where we were, where Kate is now sucking on Sam's blood, and she's like, wait, this is a strange tang to it.
Speaker B:It's different.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And they.
Speaker A:It was revealed that John killed their father, Ghoul Kate and Ghoul Adam.
Speaker A:And they're from there enforcing them to grow up without a father, which, from their perspective, makes John a monster.
Speaker B:And are they wrong because.
Speaker A:But they're like, what we just.
Speaker A:Because this is how we survive.
Speaker A:We're bad people now.
Speaker A:Like, we usually just.
Speaker B:They were eating the dead.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, yeah, there were 17 bodies that were taken from the cemetery.
Speaker B:Big fucking whoop.
Speaker A:Like, I have a weird question that there may not be an answer to.
Speaker A:I know you've described the Arabic perception of the ghouls.
Speaker A:So in this iteration of ghouls from this episode is.
Speaker A:Does A ghoul have a form or a physical identity?
Speaker A:Or is it if they are carried over from the previous thing they ate and how do they procreate them?
Speaker A:And it just confused me and I blew my mind.
Speaker B:I can get that.
Speaker B:I will also say for this episode, the monster was kind of shoved in where they originally were.
Speaker B:Just they wanted the storyline to happen of the additional sun.
Speaker B:And then they kind of just went with the monsters.
Speaker B:And eventually I think they were originally wanting to do wraiths and then they ended up transposing it to ghouls because they thought it made sense.
Speaker B:But I would think it's almost more like a shape shifter.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Like where we saw them, like, you know, they become the form.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:I know, but that was.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:Yeah, no, I mean, I'm sure that's probably what makes the most sense.
Speaker A:But can you see like where I was like, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:You know, I was like, well, what are they like originally?
Speaker A:How are they born?
Speaker B:Like, well, and that's the, like the, the Arabic shape shifting ghouls.
Speaker B:Like, they have their form and typically it's a female form and it's just like this hunched over, like, monster that's really hairy and so like, and then they can just be like, oh, but now my pretty woman in this case would be like, oh, now I'm Kate, now I'm Adam.
Speaker A:Interesting.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So at least they didn't give you the mirror thing.
Speaker B:Like they could have like, really with you and given you like the mirror look with like the really gross things.
Speaker B:So just, just go with it and be happy they didn't do that.
Speaker A:I am.
Speaker A:I just was overthinking it.
Speaker A:Yeah, I was angry at this episode in general.
Speaker A:So we cut back to Dean in the crypt.
Speaker A:He has now slid a coffin over and he breaks the ceiling glass and it's going to pull himself out.
Speaker A:That is some fucking upper body strength.
Speaker B:That was a fucking gymnastics as somebody who has to try and like pike her body up and I don't do it.
Speaker B:Well, there's nothing pretty happening here.
Speaker B:I was just like, damn, Dean, like, that is good on you.
Speaker B:That was good grip strength, good use of your core.
Speaker B:Way to go, Jensen Ackles and your stunt double, who I probably could look in two seconds.
Speaker A:But yeah, stunt double ghoul Adam is digging his finger into Sam's side and it's real gross.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker B:And that happens in others.
Speaker B:Like, remember like in the Buffy episode where the, that ghoul or whatever is like stripping out like, like Willow's like, stomach.
Speaker B:I Don't know, like, why the stomach, like, to me, grosses me out more.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:They're really into the stomach area.
Speaker A:And Ghoul Kate is explaining that they grew up alone without their dad because of John continuing that.
Speaker A:And her comment is that you can only count on family.
Speaker A:So it's kind of an interesting.
Speaker A:Throwing it back at Sam.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:They spent 20 years living like rats, and so now we decide to move up to fresher game and get our revenge because revenge is never over.
Speaker A:Turn that back too.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Which also, like, from a lore perspective, I don't like, because I feel like Ghoul, if they're going to eat the dead, they're eating the dead because they want to eat the dead.
Speaker B:Otherwise they would have been eating people for long before.
Speaker B:Unless it was just a cultural thing.
Speaker B:Like this was like the food that we eat, but.
Speaker B:But then we find out disturbingly that they ate Adam alive.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Slowly.
Speaker A:That's really sad.
Speaker A:And then.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And then Ghoul Kate reveals to Sam, just to dash any last thoughts, that he really was your brother.
Speaker A:And now I'm like, this is really fucking sad.
Speaker A:This is very upsetting.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then they start, like, as much as.
Speaker A:Let me.
Speaker A:Let me go off on it for a second.
Speaker A:Because as much as these brothers, like, were not stoked about having this new brother and they are jealous of him and they're even madder at more shit that dad kept from them.
Speaker A:They're very, very family loyal and who, like, if you had any ounce of you starting to accept this kid as your additional kid who's an adult, but still, whatever this person as your additional sibling and trying to reconcile that at all, only to, like, in days have it, like, be like, no, no, no, by the way, they're dead and they tricked you.
Speaker A:But they were real.
Speaker A:But they're already dead.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's a total mind.
Speaker B:It is.
Speaker B:It is a mind.
Speaker A:So anyways, I'm sorry.
Speaker A:All right, so now they're gonna slice.
Speaker A:Slice up Salmon, drain his blood.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:But I'm like, how are you directing this blood spray?
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:Like, I guess maybe if you're laying down, your blood would drip.
Speaker B:But I would just imagine, like, as you cut somebody, like, blood just goes like that.
Speaker A:There's some.
Speaker A:There's some pressure behind it at first.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And also, like, Sam would be like, dead.
Speaker B:Like, they just.
Speaker B:They slit like so many tendons.
Speaker B:It's like you don't come back from this.
Speaker B:Like, Sam is never pulling a trigger again.
Speaker B:They.
Speaker B:They up his hand.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:But then Dean Bus in and shoots at, you know, Adam first.
Speaker A:And then I'm like, ghoul Adam.
Speaker B:I'm like, ghoul Adam.
Speaker B:Ghoul Adam.
Speaker A:And Sam's yelling, they're ghouls.
Speaker A:So Dean's like, oh, so I have to do head shots.
Speaker B:Well, and why did he just shoot off the head in the first place?
Speaker B:Like, to me, like, I'm just not sure.
Speaker A:If you go for a headshot, you're golden.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, I don't know how to kill this thing.
Speaker B:Like, shoot in the head.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So shotgun.
Speaker A:He ends up after he shoots off Ghoul Kate's head, but ends up in a fight with Ghoul Adam while Sam is bleeding out.
Speaker A:And it is not good for not looking good for Sam Winchester on the table with his little bowls collecting his blood.
Speaker A:Which, by the way, for as much as he should be bleeding, they seemed very empty.
Speaker A:I'm just saying.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker B:But that was not I'm going to kill you amount of blood that was.
Speaker B:Oh, shit, I cut my finger.
Speaker A:Then we're like.
Speaker A:The slices were okay, oh, shit, you're gonna die.
Speaker A:But the amount of blood dripping from them was not.
Speaker B:Well, unless maybe it goes back to my earlier point.
Speaker B:And they weren't, like, actually, like, funneling it in the right direction.
Speaker B:And, like, most of it was, like, falling on the floor, which is what would happen if I tried to do that.
Speaker B:Like, I would just have, like, this.
Speaker B:There would just be blood.
Speaker B:Like, it'd be all my cleavage, probably, because that's where everything goes.
Speaker A:Oh, well.
Speaker B:So then Dean and Adam are fighting.
Speaker A:Oh, my God, it's so weird.
Speaker B:And then Dean hits Adam a lot.
Speaker A:Like, a lot a lot.
Speaker A:Like, it's uncomfortable a lot.
Speaker B:It's an uncomfortable amount of hitting.
Speaker B:Working out your issues on this guy.
Speaker A:That gets the rage about what I just said about having, like, discovering a brother and then having him taken away and immediately by this creature.
Speaker A:I think that's part of it.
Speaker A:I think that was the rage.
Speaker A:Does that make sense?
Speaker B:Yeah, that's right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Whatever it is.
Speaker B:Dean's got and he's unhappy and he's unfortunately.
Speaker B:I mean, or fortunately, I don't know, like.
Speaker B:Because I'm kind of on these ghoul sides.
Speaker B:Except for the fact they started eating people.
Speaker B:Like, yeah, they were kind of in the right here.
Speaker B:But yeah.
Speaker B:So Dean finally just hits Adam till he.
Speaker B:He's dead.
Speaker B:And Sam's like, hi, please help me.
Speaker A:I'm bleeding out.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So, yeah, they.
Speaker A:Back at the mausoleum, we cut Dean,.
Speaker B:Cuts him loose, and Then he says, that's what family is for.
Speaker A:So back at the cemetery, they're outside the mausoleum and there is a body wrapped in the sheet.
Speaker A:And Dean says that, you know, the ghouls didn't fake the photos or the journal.
Speaker A:And we're going to properly send off Adam.
Speaker B:Yeah, we're going to give him a hunter's funeral.
Speaker B:He died like a hunter.
Speaker B:So we're going to.
Speaker B:We're going to do this like this.
Speaker B:And then they watch him burn.
Speaker A:Casper a favor.
Speaker A:And Dean's like, no know Adam's in a better place.
Speaker B:Well, also, like, it's what you just know the angels can like, raise the dead.
Speaker B:And we're just gonna keep like doing this now.
Speaker B:Like, what?
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:Like, we're going down like a weird path.
Speaker B:And also, I think, you know, what Dean says is appropriate, is no, why would I bring him back to this?
Speaker B: probably, like, if he was in: Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:Nope.
Speaker B:You just stay where you are.
Speaker B:Whatever is happening over there, probably better.
Speaker A:But then we get very intense conversation between our brothers.
Speaker A:It's not really intense, but it's very revealing.
Speaker B:It's very emotional.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And Dean says, I finally.
Speaker A:Finally gets why Sam and John butted head so much, was that they were so much alike.
Speaker A:Dean's like, I worshiped him, but you're more like him.
Speaker A:And then Sam's like, oh, well, I take that as a compliment.
Speaker A:He's like, you can take it any way you want.
Speaker A:Ouch.
Speaker B:But also, I very much from.
Speaker B:I get this like, the.
Speaker B:As someone who is very much like my father, like, understand, like, the.
Speaker B:That realization of like, oh, shit, no wonder you didn't get along.
Speaker B:It's because you're exactly the same.
Speaker B:Like, as you know, I realized why my father was so hard on me is because I was exactly like him.
Speaker B:You know, And Dean coming to this thought about Sam and Sam's not there yet.
Speaker B:I don't think Sam gets it.
Speaker B:Like, but Sam is acting like John.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Feeling very cold.
Speaker A:Very, like, mission focused only and very.
Speaker A:That's it.
Speaker B:And mission focus.
Speaker B:We protect our own and.
Speaker B:And we just do what we can.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But even this, he wasn't protecting his own because he was willing to sacrifice Adam for this hunt.
Speaker B:He was just like, even.
Speaker B:It was like, we'll protect him, like, whatever.
Speaker B:Using your brother as bait.
Speaker B:You know, what the fuck happens when something is bait?
Speaker A:Not good.
Speaker B:I want to know why you did not like this episode.
Speaker A:And there were scary parts I had to cover my eyes then it was really sad.
Speaker A:That's what I'm not like the ooh.
Speaker A:Like and honestly like the scary wasn't like.
Speaker A:I mean like the creepy crawly.
Speaker A:Like I just like I can handle the things grabbing you from underneath.
Speaker A:Stuff's freaky.
Speaker A:Don't like it didn't like being trapped in a crypt.
Speaker A:That just gave me heebie jeebies real bad.
Speaker A:That was kind of scary.
Speaker A:But it was like they did good.
Speaker A:Like suspense build up on it.
Speaker A:So that was successful in the episode.
Speaker A:Just didn't mean I like it and that.
Speaker A:But like the storyline was really sad.
Speaker A:Like it's like as I'm.
Speaker A:Because as a viewer and I'm sure this is what happened when the first.
Speaker A:When this episode first came out out too is I'm trying to emotionally grapple with like is this going to be a long term character?
Speaker A:Am I going to like this character?
Speaker A:Let me observe everything about this character because I'm going to be watching this character on the show for years to come and like really processing all this.
Speaker B:They fucking killed him.
Speaker B:Or actually he was killed to begin with.
Speaker B:Like it was dead before they got there probably.
Speaker A:Who knows.
Speaker A:But like yeah, it was like a whole.
Speaker A:It was a very like emotional thing.
Speaker A:I will confess as you know I am a virgin viewer.
Speaker A:I also do a little bit of research on our show after I watch the episode so I can talk about it intelligently.
Speaker A:Specifically looking at like IMDb for characters and things that are on it.
Speaker A:So full disclosure obviously.
Speaker B:Spoiler alert.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Kate Milligan was played by dede Pfeiffer.
Speaker A:She was.
Speaker A:She was in a lot of stuff, big movies in like the 80s, like huge movies.
Speaker A:She was Sheila and Falling Down.
Speaker A:Just a bunch of TV episodes.
Speaker A:She was on the TV show Sybil for years which I guess.
Speaker B:Oh, I forgot about that show.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:She was Rachel on Sybil.
Speaker A:Like so she's had.
Speaker A:She's had.
Speaker A:So I'm not.
Speaker A:Not like she just was in a lot bigger stuff before.
Speaker A:And then Adam Milligan was played by Jake Abel who was Ian in the movie the host those.
Speaker A:Movie was okay anyways.
Speaker A:And he was Luke in the Percy Jackson movies.
Speaker A:His main stuff.
Speaker A:And it's hard to overlook when you see that they're in more than one year of the show that you're watching.
Speaker A:But I will that be.
Speaker B:I will say I think the best quote about this and this is from the Supernatural Wiki but they pulled this from Entertainment Weekly and there was an Entertainment Weekly article that said of Jake Abel, the Actor playing the new sibling is a Wincest buff stream.
Speaker B:He looks so much like Padalecki and Ackles.
Speaker B:He could be their magical gay offspring.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker B:So I got to bring Wincest back a second time.
Speaker B:The second week in a row.
Speaker B:God damn it.
Speaker B:Like, I will get in every.
Speaker B:Every week now.
Speaker A:Like, I have to explain to Dave what winces was.
Speaker B:He laughed at me.
Speaker B:He thought it was hilarious at a face.
Speaker B:But I do love that magical gay offspring.
Speaker B:And it is like, you know, he looks like a really good cross between.
Speaker A:For sure as well.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I mean, I don't like this just because I think.
Speaker B:I don't like this because I feature.
Speaker B:I know.
Speaker B:But I think I don't like it because I knew that the surprise.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Like, I knew why this episode was sad.
Speaker B:I knew why this was.
Speaker B:Like, I came into this episode being like this one.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like another kid losing their mom.
Speaker A:Like, it's just.
Speaker A:It's just sad.
Speaker A:I don't like it.
Speaker B:Well, it also, like, is you.
Speaker B:It's probably been, like, a year since I did my last rewatch.
Speaker B:A year.
Speaker B:I haven't done a rewatch since we started the podcast, so.
Speaker B:And there are things.
Speaker B:Things from this episode that I forgot, really More about, like, his mom.
Speaker B:Like, I forgot about how many pictures.
Speaker B:Like, that whole, like, John potentially Kate storyline.
Speaker B:I forgot about that.
Speaker B:And I think I'm probably thinking more.
Speaker B:Because I'm just thinking more about John Winchester with the new series coming out, which I'm also thinking about, do we have to keep Diana from watching the new series when it comes up?
Speaker B:Because it's going to ruin so much.
Speaker B:Oh, it's so weird.
Speaker A:I'm have to wait.
Speaker A:We'll see.
Speaker B:I think you may have to.
Speaker B:And then we'll.
Speaker B: is done, which will be, like,: Speaker B:So, you know, it'll.
Speaker B:It'll be fun.
Speaker B:Anyways.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:This has been a long conversation.
Speaker B:I know we had a lot of notes on this episode, but that's just because it was a very important episode.
Speaker B:As much as we don't like it.
Speaker B:Like, there is a lot of shit that came out in it.
Speaker B:I think there's a lot of relationship.
Speaker A:Building, a lot to unpack emotionally.
Speaker A:For sure.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:About the relationship.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:So with that, I think we're gonna end it out.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:Cheers.
Speaker B:Jerk.
Speaker A:Cheers.
Speaker A:Devil's Trap podcast is part of the Ship it Studios Podcast network.
Speaker B:Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Devil's Trap Podcast.
Speaker A:Be sure to follow us on Instagram Devil's Trap Podcast Twitter Devil's Trap Podcast Pod or you can email us devilstrapevilstrappodcast.com.
Speaker B:Don't forget to subscribe, leave reviews and share it with all your friends.
Speaker B:We're available at all your major podcast listening devices, so you can always find us@devilstrappodcast.com thanks.
Speaker B:Devil's Trap Podcast is a don't be a Dick production.
Speaker A:Meow Intro Music arrangement, arrangement and performance by Dave Cox Piano arrangement and performance by Bobby Orozco Meow.
